Essential Hornbill

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Essential Hornbill

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Rajkumar
Essential Hornbill
Fri Mar 09, 2018 9:24 pm
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--
Art is about what is inside rather than what is outside


Rajkumar  Joined CNP On 21 Mar 2011    Total Image posts 310    -   Total Image Comments 808    -   Image Post to Comment Ratio 1:3    -   Image Comment Density 28     -     Total Forum Posts 57

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Commentby Prashanth Sampagar on Fri Mar 09, 2018 10:42 pm

Excellent, Raj! Why I want to see a backlit tree here, not sure. TFS

Regards,
Prashanth

Commentby ramesh_adkoli on Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:59 am

Raj, you have very nicely brought out the essence of a hornbill here. Yet, a question pops up in my mind: is this still a photograph or it is stepping into the realm of digital art? Where do you draw the boundary? Would love to hear your views...

Commentby Rajkumar on Sat Mar 10, 2018 10:29 am

thanks both.

Good question Ramesh. Here is my take

So, two part answer

1. Artistic intent……I am questioning/exploring the assumptions the brain is making in assembling and making meaning out of those 6 shapes. The black space in between gives no info that the shapes are from one single object. Based on my title , past memories it is a logical conclusion but assumptions nevertheless
• Also struck me that if we program a software to recognize a bird image among other inputs we would ask it learn that these basic shapes (there would be number of other inputs ) arranged in this way is 90% a bird …you get the drift
At this stage for me artistic intent and connect is supreme….photo / digital art does not really matter. I could as well do this on a photocopying machine if that gives me the desired results …process would be important only for repeatability and to apply to other objects and circumstances

2. Having said that Photo to Digital art. Mostly the boundary condition of what is in and what is out is personal with a lot of common ground in the basics. So here is my take on it being a photograph ( but I would not over defend keeping point 1 in mind )
a. I was there, the bird was there, was taken with a camera
b. Had an imagination that the whites tips could be brought out this way while making the exposure
c. No elements added or taken away
d. Only played with contrast and shadows ( actually just processed on RAW no even PS )

But would definitely invite others to give their thoughts. No worries let’s have an open discussion

--
Art is about what is inside rather than what is outside


» Last edited by Rajkumar on Sat Mar 10, 2018 10:36 am; edited 1 time in total

Commentby ramesh_adkoli on Sat Mar 10, 2018 6:59 pm

Thanks Raj. However this leads to couple of more observations/questions. I'm sure others here can pitch in to take this interesting debate forward...

1. On the Artistic Intent: Human brain has this intrinsic ability to fill in missing information when we see an object. Here's a quote from a research paper: "If you didn't have the brain filling in all of this missing information, every time you looked at an object from a slightly different view, it would be a different object and that would be very confusing and difficult to cope with. This filling in gives some consistency and continuity to the world." This leads to interesting possibilities when we take a contrarian view. When does this ability breakdown? Do you want to explore that? Curious to know your thoughts...

2. Any art form cannot be looked at in isolation of its tools, techniques and processes. Art form is a sum total of all this + the creativity of the artist. If we distinguish photography and digital art as two separate art forms (IMO they are), I need to understand this. If extreme contrast or such adjustment leads to suppression of key objects in the image, does "nothing added/taken away" hold?

Regards,
Ramesh



» Last edited by ramesh_adkoli on Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:03 pm; edited 1 time in total

Commentby Sriharsha Ganjam on Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:31 pm

OMG! Amazing image!!! True beauty of minimalism. I will never look at another hornbill in quite the same way again Raj!
As for the ensuing debate, I would like to accept Ramesh's invite to add onto on his point
"If you didn't have the brain filling in all of this missing information, every time you looked at an object from a slightly different view, it would be a different object and that would be very confusing and difficult to cope with. This filling in gives some consistency and continuity to the world."
I think the beauty of Art is the very fact that it gives us this opportunity to fill in what ever we want, however we want. Why do we need art to lead us into a consistent and continuos world? We have science for that in fact the person who stated the above statement must have been a scientist (also because it was published in a research paper :P )The best thing about imagination is that it can take us places and show us sights nobody has ever seen. Who wouldn't want to see tigers in Bamboo leaves?

Commentby dinesh.ramarao on Mon Mar 12, 2018 10:50 am

Pareidolia : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareidolia

While Wikepedia explanation emphasis is on "recognizable human like faces", my understanding is that it is a psychological phenomenon in which the mind responds to a stimulus, usually an image or a sound, by perceiving a familiar pattern where none exists. It does mean to me that our minds try to fill in the "empty" space, not literally in the image space, but mostly the "empty" space created in our mind while viewing such images.

Here are some recent examples from CNP:

http://www.creativenaturephotography.net/forum/phpBB3_0_1/gallery/image_page.php?album_id=16&image_id=14457
On the first look, we ignore RaviPrakash's Vine. We see it on the second look. Now the mind is tuned to see it again and again.

http://www.creativenaturephotography.net/forum/phpBB3_0_1/gallery/image_page.php?album_id=16&image_id=14470
Dr.Sanjay's image on the first look give ""recognizable human like face", but on the second look we understand it as part of a tree.

http://www.creativenaturephotography.net/forum/phpBB3_0_1/gallery/image_page.php?album_id=1&image_id=14406
http://www.creativenaturephotography.net/forum/phpBB3_0_1/gallery/image_page.php?album_id=1&image_id=14456
Ghanshyam has shown human like shapes to us with his series of images.

http://www.creativenaturephotography.net/forum/phpBB3_0_1/gallery/image_page.php?image_id=14458
Yellappa's image. Harsha wants to see a human shape in the image, Ghanshyam felt the tree is himself. Here, the fact of devastation, not sure if the fire is natural forest fire (which is unlikely) or man made, created emotions in the viewer faster than images with sense of peace or happiness could grow in the mind. What do I see is different than what do you see or what did the artist see.

I can pull out images like these from CNP,

As Harsha said above, "I think the beauty of Art is the very fact that it gives us this opportunity to fill in what ever we want, however we want."
and
"Who wouldn't want to see tigers in Bamboo leaves?"
http://www.creativenaturephotography.net/forum/phpBB3_0_1/gallery/image_page.php?album_id=16&image_id=9666

Such images grow in the mind.
-RD



» Last edited by dinesh.ramarao on Mon Mar 12, 2018 11:04 am; edited 3 times in total

Commentby trvikas on Mon Mar 12, 2018 2:25 pm

Fabulous, i remember similar Peacock image that you had posted some time back.

--
"The art of simplicity is a puzzle of complexity."
-Vikas
PhotoGallery of Vikas

Commentby Ganesh H Shankar on Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:34 pm

Quintessential hornbill!

Beyond 1+1=2, I am almost certain that

Truth is a lie.

--
Ganesh H. Shankar
Wishing you best light,

Image
Personal Websites Fine Art Nature Photography | www.ArtOfLife.Gallery
Facebook Pages Ganesh H. Shankar | Fine Art Nature Photography | Art Of Life



» Last edited by Ganesh H Shankar on Mon Mar 12, 2018 9:26 pm; edited 1 time in total

Commentby Rajkumar on Tue Mar 13, 2018 7:52 am

thanks all. Nice discussion. I am tempted to connect RD's and Ganesh's point

@ RD in some ways can we say the mind is a "meaning making machine " can we take the forward as say " truth is personal reality "
My truth may be a lie for someone else also my own truth may be a lie sometime later. My truth in a dream is a lie when i wake up
At least "Truth is a Lie " must be true for all :)

In a lighter vein .....
" A Statistician , Mathematician and Logic person were looking at a black Goat in Scotland... All goats in Scotland are black was Statisticians conclusion...we do not know that but this goat is black was Mathematician opinion. We do not know about that ( Logic person ) with the information we have we can only say this side of the Goat is black"

--
Art is about what is inside rather than what is outside


» Last edited by Rajkumar on Tue Mar 13, 2018 8:14 am; edited 2 times in total

Commentby nevilzaveri on Tue Mar 13, 2018 7:17 pm

utterly genial presentation, raj, simply mindboggling! .. growing with the image n every word poured-in :D
tfs.

--
nevil zaveri
http://www.flickr.com/people/nevilzaveri/

Commentby Raviprakash S S on Tue Mar 13, 2018 10:29 pm

This hornbill must be as happy as black and white Peacock! Stunning to say the least Raj.

Happy to see intense discussion here. As Harsha mentioned "I think the beauty of Art is the very fact that it gives us this opportunity to fill in what ever we want, however we want." I choose not to fill anything in between black and white and just enjoy the pattern!

--
Cheers,
Raviprakash.S.S
www.raviprakash.co.in

Commentby Adithya Biloor on Wed Mar 14, 2018 11:32 am

Oh, yes, I agree with Prashanth on the backlit tree part. But, then again, that would have diluted the "essential hornbill" part.

Photo or digital art?
Couple of years back I was contemplating over the photographs of a photographer who shot only black and white photographs. Only blacks and whites, no greys in between. To get that effect he must have pushed brightness and contrast slider to extreme, (in some photos). Is it a photo or Digital art? But suddenly something flashed in my mind. What if he had a camera which can handle only 2-3 stops of dynamic range? Which can produce only black and white photos? Wait, then again, b/w itself is unrealistic. I never see anything in b/w.

But, then again
I need to understand this. If extreme contrast or such adjustment leads to suppression of key objects in the image, does "nothing added/taken away" hold?"
is a valid question.

Probably I agree with Ganesh

Truth is a lie

--
Regards,
Adithya Biloor
www.lensandtales.com



» Last edited by Adithya Biloor on Wed Mar 14, 2018 11:33 am; edited 1 time in total

Commentby Rajkumar on Fri Mar 16, 2018 8:29 am

Thanks, all. Enriched by the discussion. Have to say CNP has always helped me improve

--
Art is about what is inside rather than what is outside

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